I read something that said that a team can only have two players on the designated rookie max extension. Does that mean that even if Ayton gets the max next year, the Suns can still at some point trade for another team's star that is on a max extension?
(Still agree with you that it's probably best to just max him now but is there an added benefit?)
You can only have 2 guys on Designated Rookie Max Extensions at any given time. So if Ayton gets 1 that will make him & Booker, which rules out the Suns adding a third unless Booker or Ayton are in the same trade.
But now he hasn't got the extension, it's a new contract and no longer subject to that rule, right? I've had a little more time to look at it than earlier and although cbafaq isn't totally clear, this (https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2018/12/hoops-rumors-glossary-designated-rookies-rose-rule.html) says he wouldn't be considered a designated rookie. Of course, that could be wrong!
Anyway based on your 🌶️ that I've now read, or even just the idea of trading for another designated rookie regardless of CP3-related conspiracies, it's clear Jones wants to avoid Ayton being a designated rookie. If a 5yr max next offseason does indeed mean he's still not considered designated, then presumably he's well on track to get it after all. And if the link above is wrong and he would be considered designated if he signs a 5yr max next offseason, then maybe he only gets 4 whether it's with the Suns outright or via an offer sheet (or maybe they give him the 5 anyway).
A little bonus material that I just had to share somewhere, just in case. To be honest, this has been swirling around in my head for a few months but it all kind of just clicked in the last few days. Enjoy the craziness!
Clue #1 - Chris Paul opts out of his $44.2 Player Option for 21/22 & signs a 4 year deal with PHX. While I wrote about it here ahead of time: https://thefourpointplay.substack.com/p/vol3-iss1-the-loophole - perhaps the motivation for a 4 year deal was actually different all along?
Clue #3 - In trying to explain the decision to not sign Deandre Ayton to an extension, James Jones mentions the Suns did not want to be locked into the maximum 2 players you are allowed on such deals, in case an opportunity arises to trade for one.
So what does it all mean? Basically, there have been a number of Front Office decisions made this off-season that point to wanting the flexibility *IF* the possibility of trading for another star arose.
And that's where we get back to none other than Chris Paul.
Why opt out & totally re-structure your deal, just to have the Suns sign the likes of JaVale McGee & Elfrid Payton + re-sign Cam Payne to a deal the Suns likely could have afforded anyway? Well....maybe, just maybe that isn't quite the end game.
Stay with me here folks....A theory:
What if CP3, Sarver & Jones have a wink wink nudge nudge type understanding?
Chris Paul opted out of $44.2mil & signed for $30.8mil in 21/22. CP3 then gets $15.8mil guaranteed in 23/24, which is slightly more than the difference in $$ he let go for this season. Interesting.
By opting out Paul gives the Suns a lot more flexibility to improve the team this season. Not just the current additions but ALSO the flexibility to do other things if the opportunity presents itself. See: CLUE #2.
THEN....presumably there is a 1 year commitment from Sarver to pay the Luxury Tax next season in 22/23. So, let's essentially call it that he signed 1 year $30mil for 22/23. Cause that's really all it is. They just moved the money he was meant to earn in 21/22 & put it at the backend in 23/24 instead, with a few extra million $$ on top as a thank you for deferring the cash.
Chris Paul will be 39 years old when that deferred payment kicks in. What if Paul knows he's out by then? Here comes the giant leap.....
The $15.8 mil owed to CP3 in 23/24 is essentially a golden hand shake thats already agreed upon, between Paul, Sarver & Jones. It was money he was already going to get, they just moved it to help the team in the short term. But why would Paul do that?
Because he wants a Title, that's why. This was all done with an understanding. Some sort of a promise from Jones & Sarver that they would trade for a big name if the opportunity arose. Nothing is guaranteed in the NBA but Paul has been around long enough to know that every now & then things can change. The best thing you can do is make sure you are in a position to capitalise on it. And that's where Jones' weird comments about wanting a Designated spot left open comes from.
Oh & by the way....by adding a 4th year to the CP3 deal using 'The Loophole' the Suns can stretch out the golden handshake over 5 years after Paul is waived. Meaning they only get hit with $3.5mil each year.
That's important because adding another star might be just as much about keeping Booker happy post-CP3 retirement, than it is about MAYBE getting Paul his first Title.
To end - here's the not so fun counterpoint to all of this that is much more likely: Sarver & Jones just didn't think Ayton was worth tying a Designated Max to & therefore didn't offer it.
But just for fun here are the current NBA players on Designated Rookie Extension Deals: Doncic, Young, SGA, MPJ, Mitchell, Tatum, Adebayo, Fox, Simmons, Murray, KAT.
It's the start of a list but I wouldn't consider it the WHOLE list. Basically, don't get too caught up in Jones' specific comment. I mostly think it was damage control & the Suns could look to trade for anyone in the NBA that adds to their top end talent. Or maybe they don't? Let's wait & see.
I read something that said that a team can only have two players on the designated rookie max extension. Does that mean that even if Ayton gets the max next year, the Suns can still at some point trade for another team's star that is on a max extension?
(Still agree with you that it's probably best to just max him now but is there an added benefit?)
You can only have 2 guys on Designated Rookie Max Extensions at any given time. So if Ayton gets 1 that will make him & Booker, which rules out the Suns adding a third unless Booker or Ayton are in the same trade.
But now he hasn't got the extension, it's a new contract and no longer subject to that rule, right? I've had a little more time to look at it than earlier and although cbafaq isn't totally clear, this (https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2018/12/hoops-rumors-glossary-designated-rookies-rose-rule.html) says he wouldn't be considered a designated rookie. Of course, that could be wrong!
Anyway based on your 🌶️ that I've now read, or even just the idea of trading for another designated rookie regardless of CP3-related conspiracies, it's clear Jones wants to avoid Ayton being a designated rookie. If a 5yr max next offseason does indeed mean he's still not considered designated, then presumably he's well on track to get it after all. And if the link above is wrong and he would be considered designated if he signs a 5yr max next offseason, then maybe he only gets 4 whether it's with the Suns outright or via an offer sheet (or maybe they give him the 5 anyway).
Sorry, I wasn’t all that clear in my first reply.
Yes you are correct. Now that deadline has past, there are 2 things that are relevant to the conversation & the Suns decision:
1. Ayton will no longer be considered designated no matter what deal he signs.
2. The 30% of cap figure is no longer available, even if Ayton makes all nba this season.
Ok now I’ve got it, thanks!
By the way great read as always!
*Conspiracy Theory Alert*
A little bonus material that I just had to share somewhere, just in case. To be honest, this has been swirling around in my head for a few months but it all kind of just clicked in the last few days. Enjoy the craziness!
Clue #1 - Chris Paul opts out of his $44.2 Player Option for 21/22 & signs a 4 year deal with PHX. While I wrote about it here ahead of time: https://thefourpointplay.substack.com/p/vol3-iss1-the-loophole - perhaps the motivation for a 4 year deal was actually different all along?
Clue #2 - The Suns don't use the full MLE (therefore avoiding the hardcap) & also remain an interesting amount of $$ below the luxury tax line this offseason. You may remember I wrote about that here: https://thefourpointplay.substack.com/p/vol-3-iss-2-what-are-you-up-to-champ
Clue #3 - In trying to explain the decision to not sign Deandre Ayton to an extension, James Jones mentions the Suns did not want to be locked into the maximum 2 players you are allowed on such deals, in case an opportunity arises to trade for one.
So what does it all mean? Basically, there have been a number of Front Office decisions made this off-season that point to wanting the flexibility *IF* the possibility of trading for another star arose.
And that's where we get back to none other than Chris Paul.
Why opt out & totally re-structure your deal, just to have the Suns sign the likes of JaVale McGee & Elfrid Payton + re-sign Cam Payne to a deal the Suns likely could have afforded anyway? Well....maybe, just maybe that isn't quite the end game.
Stay with me here folks....A theory:
What if CP3, Sarver & Jones have a wink wink nudge nudge type understanding?
Chris Paul opted out of $44.2mil & signed for $30.8mil in 21/22. CP3 then gets $15.8mil guaranteed in 23/24, which is slightly more than the difference in $$ he let go for this season. Interesting.
By opting out Paul gives the Suns a lot more flexibility to improve the team this season. Not just the current additions but ALSO the flexibility to do other things if the opportunity presents itself. See: CLUE #2.
THEN....presumably there is a 1 year commitment from Sarver to pay the Luxury Tax next season in 22/23. So, let's essentially call it that he signed 1 year $30mil for 22/23. Cause that's really all it is. They just moved the money he was meant to earn in 21/22 & put it at the backend in 23/24 instead, with a few extra million $$ on top as a thank you for deferring the cash.
Chris Paul will be 39 years old when that deferred payment kicks in. What if Paul knows he's out by then? Here comes the giant leap.....
The $15.8 mil owed to CP3 in 23/24 is essentially a golden hand shake thats already agreed upon, between Paul, Sarver & Jones. It was money he was already going to get, they just moved it to help the team in the short term. But why would Paul do that?
Because he wants a Title, that's why. This was all done with an understanding. Some sort of a promise from Jones & Sarver that they would trade for a big name if the opportunity arose. Nothing is guaranteed in the NBA but Paul has been around long enough to know that every now & then things can change. The best thing you can do is make sure you are in a position to capitalise on it. And that's where Jones' weird comments about wanting a Designated spot left open comes from.
Oh & by the way....by adding a 4th year to the CP3 deal using 'The Loophole' the Suns can stretch out the golden handshake over 5 years after Paul is waived. Meaning they only get hit with $3.5mil each year.
That's important because adding another star might be just as much about keeping Booker happy post-CP3 retirement, than it is about MAYBE getting Paul his first Title.
To end - here's the not so fun counterpoint to all of this that is much more likely: Sarver & Jones just didn't think Ayton was worth tying a Designated Max to & therefore didn't offer it.
But just for fun here are the current NBA players on Designated Rookie Extension Deals: Doncic, Young, SGA, MPJ, Mitchell, Tatum, Adebayo, Fox, Simmons, Murray, KAT.
It's the start of a list but I wouldn't consider it the WHOLE list. Basically, don't get too caught up in Jones' specific comment. I mostly think it was damage control & the Suns could look to trade for anyone in the NBA that adds to their top end talent. Or maybe they don't? Let's wait & see.
I'm so honored to have found and read this spice. Thank you king.
The spice must flow.
And what if that handshake deal pulls Book and good friend KAT into the handshake deal. Players talk…